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New Citizenship System

Discussion in 'Entropia Universe' started by Jenny ferr, Nov 8, 2011.

  1. Neil

    Neil Adviser Pro Users Arkadia Adviser

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    Or at least the PP division of MA.
     
  2. Snuggins

    Snuggins Member

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    I think deposits go through MA the platform and have nothing at all to do with "planet partner Gross Revenue generated by Planet Calypso" as listed on the deed.

    The way I understand it, "planet partner gross revenue" comes only from the % of ped usage, call it decay, ped-burn, whatever, that is removed from the system during usage. And the planet partner Gross Revenue is only a % of that.

    Here is an example based on how I understand it:
    One player, born on Calypso, plays on Calypso, spends 10,000 ped. He just so happens to get back 9000 ped and withdraws it all and closes his account. So the system has taken from him 1000 ped. 50% of that goes to MA. So 500 ped is left as Gross Revenue for the planet he was born and active on, Calypso. The land deed for this citizenship system entitles the holder to 1/60,000 of 50% of that 500 ped. So a holder of one deed would get ~.42 pecs from 10k ped turn-over (250/60,000).

    It gets a little more complicated if the player isn't born on Calypso or is but does his spending on another planet, but I think it just halves the final number one more time.


    That is entropia wisdom. If everyone thought like that I don't know if the game would be a better place or just collapse! :D

    Good point about the transparency. That's my favorite part of this. I don't have much interest in buying a share of Calypso but I like the opportunity to get a small glimpse behind the curtain. :)
     
  3. harmony

    harmony Active Member Pro Users

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    I really have mixed feelings about this.

    On the plus side, the idea has been suggested by players in the past a lot, and it is a nice idea.

    On the negative side, it will encourage players to stay on calypso since they get back a small part of their decay there. So that would be bad for the other planet partners. Also their 30% ROI seems like nonsense to me, if they would get 30% ROI everyone at MA would re-mortgage there house and buy the shares themselves. And this also means they won't sell of the fpc-part of MA, meaning that they might still have a bigger vote then the other planet partners. I'm really wondering what David thinks of all this (if you're reading this david..... :).

    Personally i would prefer to be on a planet that doesn't need to get peds from players like this. In the end i will buy some since i always enjoyed the game and i feel MA needs the peds, I will keep most peds for a shop on Arkadia though (once again if you're reading this David, feel free to comment they will definately come really soon :)).
     
  4. David | Arkadia

    David | Arkadia Administrator Staff Member PAF Administrator Planet Arkadia Official

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    To be honest I am still digesting the news and thinking through what impact this may have on Arkadia. I think there are some nice benefits for the playerbase to have some ownership of their game and especially to have some say in the way it is managed (ofc it's yet to be seen how much say and on what types of issues). So on that note I'll reserve judgement and see what happens. I think if in future Arkadia was to consider something like this it would make the universe extremely interesting to observe the market price set on deeds from different planets - it sure would act as a good motivator for each planets management and design teams to perform. So long as Calypso is the only planet doing it though that won't really be an issue.

    Regarding shops (Harmony's question) everything is looking on track to introduce shop booths in the upcoming update with shops and apartments likely to follow in January.
     
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  5. Yquem

    Yquem Active Member Pro Users

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    Didn't know economy was that bad ..... (ppl should ask themself why Calypso owner / MA would share a gold mine????)

    Truely a sad day today.

    And what happens when they can sell all the deeds. Marked will be less than 1000ped and then the spin down will just go faster.
     
  6. Xaph

    Xaph Member

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    Interesting developments and whether they transpose to otther planets as benefits it remains to be seen. Some comments about selling out (all) the deeds on Caly, I doubt that :)
     
  7. Xandra

    Xandra Active Member Pro Users

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    Hi,

    mixed feelings about this.

    It's good
    that we'll see actual data finally.

    On the other hand I'd never ever throw $100 or even more at anybody that just announces a certain rate of payment, without further details, without any contract that can be enforced by law. This looks plain silly to me. What would happen if MA cannot pay the promised rates, or even would go haywire?

    "Hey Mr. Policeman, look at this screenshot! They promised me 30% per year for my $100 shares, and now they don't pay!"
    "ROFLOL. Comrades, see this punk here? Has payed $100 for 'shares' in a computer game, and now complains that it doesn't get any money! What shall we do with her?"
    "Whack, whack, whack. This will teach you not to play jokes with your police! Get outa here, and try to get a life!"

    Further
    , it's obviously another attempt to create an advantage for Calypso, the planet still held by MA itself. This, together with the recent discussions of possible ground breaking changes to the game mechanics in the Calypso forum only gives me a strange feeling.

    It doesn't fit the Universe concept when MA itself is one of the planet partners. They should act strictly neutral, and not advantage nor disadvantage any Planet Partners. It's a thin line they're walking now, IMHO.

    At last, the political system. Voting rights for landowners only? Isn't this a bit medieval?

    Conclusion:
    This seems to be quite shady to me. I cannot help but to assume that MA is in urgent need for some more fresh money, again.
    And instead of offering a thought through share system with security, binding contracts and numbers known beforehand they try to get through another dubious deal.

    No info is known but:
    No current business data, no information regarding the additional costs to actually build/ have a house, no information about the rules of the "land grab" required to claim a place for a house. And no contract for the 'shares' but a virtual item, that belongs to MA anyways, only the TT is yours. Maybe.

    I'd rather buy a "really genuine Persian carpet, promised!" for $100 from an unshaved sales agent at my doorstep, this carpet I could examine at least, and even if it's not Persian, it would keep my feet warm ...

    Have a good time!

    Edit: PS:
    I know that I don't know everything. I might be grossly wrong with what I wrote. But it's based on the information available to me at the time of posting. I might be completely wrong, and actually I really hope that this is the case.
     
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  8. Chrome

    Chrome Active Member Pro Users

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    You have WAY more control than I would about stating your opinion publically.

    If I were you, I'd be supa-pissed about this:

    Nothing quite like the company that controls the entire platform designing a new money making schemerrrrrrr... system that (currently) can ONLY be used on the planet that they (currently) control.

    Meanwhile, Arkadia management (and every other Planet "partner") is left standing in a pool of their own blood, trying to pull the knife out of their back.
     
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  9. Danton

    Danton Active Member Pro Users

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    rofl :)
    ++
     
  10. Spike Black

    Spike Black Active Member

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    I have to say this morning I'm feeling a little numb. The way the whole sale has been handled so far has left me feeling even more distanced from EU.

    It only confirms my feeling that MA only sees us as assets to bleed cash from every time their bank account gets low. The fact that someone fresh to EU now has more say over the development of a planet than someone who's spent 7-8 years there and supported MA is a kick in the teeth. I'm now waiting for the 'I own shares in Calypso so you're wrong' arguments to start. Anyone silly enough to think they'll have any sort of meaningful say in Calypso development is deluding themselves.

    And as Xandra said no published figures to backup the ROI they've suggested or what the final split will be but even if they did the deeds would sell, 'You can build your own house' was enough for some:dribble:

    I say let the resellers buy them all and then get everyone to move to Ark ;)
     
  11. KikkiJikki

    KikkiJikki Well-Known Member Pro Users

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    Xandra is quite correct that there there is a big element of risk here. All we have is an estimate of possible return with no real knowledge of the based of that return. We dont know current turnover. We don't know how much of decay is actually earmarked as revenue. We don't really know how the decay earnings are split up (keep in mind the whole issue of planet of origin vs planet of activity). So its quite murky. If I was confident of the quoted ROI, I would be investing 50k ped cos thats what I could afford. But as it is I have bought just the one deed because I am interested to see where this goes. And I will think on the issue of whether to buy another 8 to be able to participate in the land grab, if and when it is implemented. Maybe after I have dealt with my current credit card bill.

    I would prefer to buy shares in the company but that offer is not on the table.

    As to the motives of MA, well I reject claims that it is designed to advantage MA at the expense of PPs. It's clearly a revenue raising exercise. They only received 1M of the 6M deal with SEE. This way they get to potentially raise the same cash without losing control of the planet. They give up future revenue to fund the dividends and of course they still have to fund content development so its not all upside for them.

    I think its crazy to view all the business partners in EU platform (MA and PPs) as antagonists. If PPs do well then MA does well. Thats how the business model is designed. It's really not in MA's interests to set PPs up to fail. Apart from the impact on their own bottom line, the chances of attracting new PPs drop with every planet failure.

    The downside is that the 1K I deposited is not going to stay in the game, so no growth in the loot pool, and I will probably hold off on purchases from other players till my credit card recovers. So I'm not convinced there is a benefit to the in game economy.

    Regards,
    KikkiJikki
     
  12. Lee DeLioncourt

    Lee DeLioncourt Arkadian Outrider Platinum Member

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    Personally speaking, I was shocked to read all this news yesterday, and today still feel a bit numbed by it all, but I won't say more on the subject for now, other than the fact I am shocked to see the continued implementation of major systems and changes which the users of certain forums are informed of before MindArk's business partners are, it's unbelievable.

    Speaking as a mod, this new 'offering' appears to be a platform system of sorts, but at this point in time it is only available to and being used by one planet, Calypso, so in that regards this discussion is being moved to the Entropia Universe section, as it does not relate directly to Planet Arkadia.
     
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  13. endy

    endy Active Member Pro Users

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    On top of that, even if there will be some decent return, the land deed is a normal in-game item, which can be modified without even notifying you, according to the EULA.

    So today you have a part in 50% of Calypso revenue, tomorrow 25%, then 10%. MA screwed up people like this many times before, what will stop them now?
     
  14. Atlan Leticron

    Atlan Leticron Active Member

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    As usual, those old players who have kept faith and did support this universe over all those years are kept out again.
    I honestly have given up on the idea that maybe one day we get a reward from MA for our long time support.

    And about this "new" idea, I think most people don't know or have forgotten that they have try ed this before.
    There where share terminals around Calypso and people could buy shares from it.
    Eventually the idea wend belly up, terminals stopped working and where eventually removed.
    As far as I know, no one got refunded.

    I am long enough around to be very skeptical about this.
    All trades are final and if things go wrong they only have to refund the trade terminal value.
    And this value happens to be 0.0 PED.

    Good luck on those who like the gamble and I hope it works out for you.

    Regards,
    Ion
     
  15. Neil

    Neil Adviser Pro Users Arkadia Adviser

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    One thing this tells me is that MA has stopped searching for a Calypso PP and is committed to developing the planet themselves, at least for the near future. Overall, I think the plan is a good way for MA to raise the capital it needs.
     
  16. KikkiJikki

    KikkiJikki Well-Known Member Pro Users

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    I deal with MA and everyone else in good faith until they demonstrate otherwise. Of course I've only been playing 18 months so I dont have the long experience of others so am yet to be screwed over. As a risk mitigation strategy, I also don't invest more than I can afford to lose.
     
  17. MaxMoon

    MaxMoon Member

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    perhaps im being simple. I see it as anything ingame. I spent 1000ped on ammo and hope to get a return if i dont it was the risk i took (not that i have 1kPeds lol) so all i would be doing is buying another item that may or may not give me a return.

    As regards the whole voting thing, have u seen the silly sweating groups, dam if the parliment is made up of some of these folk lol well it doesnt bare thinking about :)
     
  18. Atlan Leticron

    Atlan Leticron Active Member

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    If you spend 1K hunting:
    You have the fun of the hunt,
    You always get a return, even if it is lower than that you spend.
    You can make it a social event with hunting in team with your friends.
    You have the chance on a global, HOF or even a ATH.
    A hunt is a addition to the amusement factor.

    Non of this can be done with a deed.
    It sits in your inventory and you hope it turns out right.

    Regards,
    Ion
     
  19. harmony

    harmony Active Member Pro Users

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    Ofc to some people that is fun too :)
     
  20. MaxMoon

    MaxMoon Member

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    Ion, yes you are totaly spot on, the fun factor and sitting on stuff is very boaring :) if only i had something to store lol. Lets see how it pans out