Competition Oratan Time Challenge

Had a good time, the loot was a little on the down side for me propably due to the fact that i wasn't able to score any itemloots with my z12 barbarella dps , but i met some interesting people and was fun to score 100 swirleys on a day.

 

well, with a 20 ped ammo budget I made enough to do about 35 ped worth of ammo repairs, put all my peds safely back on my card and have about 10 peds worth of ammo left. I call that a win! That's not including the skill ups, BONUS! I did decide to sell my Xent Tech Light Rifle X3 since this is the third event I've used it at and it hasn't moved from tier 1.6, oh well. Thanks Ark team for a fun event!

 

Overall a very fun event again but.....sorry there is a but....

I really wish we could do something about the mobs going unreachable.
I don't know what it would take but it really causes a lot of agro in the field and detracts from what could be a blast and I'm sure some just get sick of it and give up(I have in the past).
I know the devs are aware of it as they are there the whole time and have to listen to the bitching and moaning and are probably as sick of it as the rest of us are.
The advice to use the a,s,w,d keys was put out repeatedly by them and the players to little effect.

Making all the mounted mobs AoE might be a start but even the mobs that have AoE were getting stuck for long lengths before using it and becoming reachable again which I found pretty odd.I would have thought that getting trapped would be like an auto trigger for the AoE to kick in (they should imo but I don't know how things work 'behind the curtain' and is probably exploitable in the UG wave spawn).

The miners don't really get stuck but for me there was just way too many of them and dropping 400ped loots that are 90% item is really deflating also.So many people whining about this (myself included at times).
It wasn't until the 14th hour I finally got my first item but it was a good TT and not till the 24th hour did I see another one though it was a very nice ESI so the items are great if you're on the right side of the drop it just seems very hard,almost rare to be on that side.
You probably can't adjust them just for the event and I wouldn't want items removed from the naturally spawning ones so I really have no answer for this.
The mobs that spawned were overwhelmingly Titans but they paid OK so no complaint on that and the mob levels that did spawn seemed to be according to the DPS that was there at the time anyway.

The fight moved on to some Mechs in the Underground but by that time I'd been going for about 22 hours and I had to call it a day.

I managed to keep the Spirit MK1+Dante and 7 tiers of enhancers going for 28 hours in total with the original $200 depo I made so I'm really pleased with the returns.There was downtimes but the float I had seemed to be enough to get through the tough times.

I decided to push through the tough and annoying stuff and it paid off,you cant complain about 28hours free skilling and still having your peds at the end of it all.


So yes overall it was a fun event and the final assault from the Oratan was great to see (radar pic below).
And I cant let it go without saying a massive thanks to Jenny Ironhide,Jim Longshot and Derek Bossman for the continuous hours of healing provided (some serious overtime put in by these guys!!).

I caught a few highlights which I'll add below(I also have almost a dozen black screenshots so there was a lot more that I didn't capture )

The radar view of the final assault..



and some random HoF's (Just the big and pretty ones though I had settings on Med for playability).........




So yeah thanks again for a fun event and looking forward to the next one.
Maybe some smugglers next?
Feels like we haven't done them for while but I may have just missed it(and they don't go unreachable :biggrin2

 

As most obstacles are less than six feet high, Oratans just need to move on and mount flying mobs.
Dire Mutated Zombie Feran, for example.

 

Ohh now there's an idea

Or considering there size they should be able to just lumber over the top of us to get whomever they want.

 

I also had a ball and would like to thank the team for providing this event. Was the first of its kind I attended with returns that didn't force me to quit even before reaching operating temperature. And thanks for the heals of course!

This. Miners, Axes, in fact all of the other kinds don't have this problem, and from observing I suspect it is because of the very different animation. Especially the Axe is obviously impossible to nail in a corner or ring of attackers at all, because it is programmed to move about wildly and would just break out. I wonder if the Lancer couldn't be tweaked this way to just jump a little distance in random directions. The riding beast already goes on its hind legs all the time, it would make sense if every such movement would result in a shift of say 1 to 3 meters.

If I'm not mistaken, it also doesn't seem to be able to crush attackers under its feet, only the rider does damage with his weapon. Since we know it is possible for mobs to have at least two different attacks (Rextelum), I couldn't think of a better one than the Lancer where this would be more plausible anyway.

 

Hmm very interesting,I was not aware that was possible.

 

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?218424-Rextelum-damage-tests

 

That's very interesting thank you.

On the surface it would seem possible as Oleg said one corresponds to the claw animation and one to the tail animation but it's still targeting one person right?

We can say you'll get for instance impact from the stamping animation and stab from the guy on top but they will still be targeting the same person and will get stuck if they can't reach them(unless we give him a much larger range with his pike which would help but not solve the issue unless its like 70m or so,that's a bloody long pike!)

If they culd stamp on the guy in front and stab the guy in back then we'd be fine but I don't know that that's possible.
Instead of AoE-if that's not feasible on all maturities-then they could have a ranged attack instead of melee which is much harder to trap.

 

This was precisely my idea. I don't think it's necessary to change anything about the current damages whichever they are, only add the second attack with pure impact, stomping on whoever is in the way (not sure if it's possible to make this be area damage for the bigger ones, too). Plus the jump-shift part in its animation. This should hopefully fix it, if I'm not totally off about how it all works.

 

That's the thing though it's not a second simultaneous attack/targeting but just a second damage type on the same target.If that target is the guy in back then we are backed to trapped.

AoE to my knowledge (I'm really just guessing here) is the only method of attacking more than one target.
If an AoE can be coded to target the nearest target as well its usual target coding-the guy in the back- at the same time (we wouldn't want only the guy in front getting hit or we would just have tanks-as used in other games-taking all the damage leaving everyone else free reign to do as they please) then we could ensure its at least hitting someone but then it gets confusing as to which target it wants to actually track and chase.The AoE as it is now works because it doesn't have to target anyone,it just farts out the damage like a cloud and whoever sniffs it cops it.

But then why go to all that trouble when we can just use AoE permanently?

Or better yet just use a ranged attack and from their high position could hit anyone on the field.

I'll be the first to admit I don't know enough about the coding or what ever is required so take anything I say with a grain of salt.

 

Me neither, all is just guesstimate until someone from the inside says this can and that cannot. Brainstorming anyway, maybe it gets me a job one day

How would this occur anyway? I imagine, only if the mob targets someone who is at the front first, that person is not aware and, thinking he does the right thing, moves to the back while the mob is stuck like a square peg in its hole and cannot turn. About right? If this is the main problem, then the entire attack logic might have to be re-thought if there isn't a simpler way.

It might not be possible for the planet team to make a mob switch targets faster or detect such patterns. It's probably at the core where only MA can put it in the code. And they will say go redraw your mob before spending money on fixing a problem nobody else has.

I imagine the random jump as described or some other tweak of the mob's animation could be the easiest method to resolve such situations, or rather, would prevent it getting there at all. If the Axe can break out easily, I see no reason to assume something else can't. Only design limits it.

Whether AoE all the way is the solution, I have my doubts also. Did you notice, several times during the event someone was cursing upon getting hit, wanted "give us AoE instead". Because it is divided by so many, you can easily absorb it with hp and/or armour and just ignore and keep standing where you shouldn't. It doesn't solve anything if we don't get them wiped off the field reliably. Maybe if the total damage was just increased 20-fold, but then everybody would be dead at once. (I got badly stuck at Nea's revive terminal once when too many avatars spawned all inside of each other, nobody could move or jump out of the way.)

 

I can be wrong but i feel that oratan event do not give same amount of skills as it did on start in past.
So someone at MA or PP is able to do miracles with those mobs including with AOE ofc if they want to.
AOE range is probably PP problem to make changes in its stats to hit more faar, other things need to request to some lasy MA guy.

 

Well we can't have the mob only ever targeting the closest guy and sticking with him until dead or we would would then be in a 'tanking' situation.

Why is tanking not ideal?
Lets say for example you have someone with serious HP that can stand there all day naked with a modfap and take all the cheap decay whilst 40 more players (who don't have mod faps therefore have varying costs for defence,armour,uneco faps etc) can happily shoot all day with no repercussion or defensive costs.
You'll notice the mob will even move away from whatever target it has acquired if it can't kill it after some time,
"If I can't get that gun off the field and reduce the available DPS then I'll get someone else,I need to create some regen".
Regen equals higher cost to kill and though it might not be much its the pennies and pecs that add up.
This is when it is possible for the mob to target the back row.

Again if the mob only ever targets the front line then we'd just have a couple of tanks whilst everyone else stands at full range and it's max dps from go to whoa again,no pennies and pecs for the company.
Making the targeting time shorter more akin to Axes might help but it has to be able to kill people and get them off the field and that would happen less if people can handle a couple hits.
More DPS still on the field(generally higher DPS from higher or even medium skilled players that can survive the hits) and mobs die in record time thus removing any regen that might have happened,pennies and pecs.

I think the big thing to remember is the size of the Axe in comparison to the Mounteds.
Think of it like a game of Pachinko, The axes are small balls that can fit between the 'pegs' but the Oratan are like trying to shove a tennis ball in the machine.So a simple tweak like that may not have the full benefit in a tightly packed field.

Yeah I tend to agree here.
AoE only wouldn't be the best solution because as you said the damage spread could make it so no-one dies,but I see that as a pennies and pecs thing rather than an issue of people being able to remain where they stand,that in itself isn't an issue because the mob can now hit targets anyway and therefore become unstuck.

I know I was calling for it to use it's AoE immediately after getting stuck simply to free it again quickly.

As mentioned sending everyone to the revive at once is problematic not to mention not much fun but people do have to die whether they like it or not so a single target method is still required rather than just making massive AoE.
We've probably all seen a similar revive jam situation many times,The bot invasion that wiped out the best City on caly and left nothing but a crater comes to mind, so again not really a solution though changes were made to improve this some.

So we have to think of the simplest solution to solve all these things....
1. Use AoE immediately on becoming stuck.(a short term solution but not without it's issues)
2. Change its pattern of movement (not without it's issues)
3. Make them completely ranged (Possible turning into a mass revive issue).
4. Make their AoE stronger (not really helpful if they don't use it fast enough as we have now)
5. Give the mobs the ability to climb over people (I may be wrong here but I think this is what creates the issue of mobs flying up in to the sky that shouldn't)
6. Use a melee attack majority of the time but switch to a ranged attack on becoming stuck.(would seem the simplest to me)
7. Something simple my thick head failed to think of (extremely possible)

I'm leaning towards 6 with a strong possibility on 7.

At the end of the day Dave is a switched on bloke and wouldn't have hired dummies so I'm sure this is something they have probably already pondered many times and have probably come up with everything we have said and more.


This discussion is probably completely moot and pointless but I find it interesting to discuss these things and get people's opinions.
At the end of the day we all want the same thing and that's an enjoyable game experience for everyone.

 

In some oher games succesful tactic and goal is to get boss mob stuck sorounded by tankers and mele fighers who have also special agro skill to keep mob on them.
Reason - melee fighters and so called tankers have enought hp to survive at least one or two hits so their job is to keep boss agro on them and to not let him run to much arround so healers, bufers, mages and archers can deal damage or heal from safe distance.
If boss get to kill healers and buffers raid is ower - all including melee fighters are dead fast.
And that happen often , boss souronded by 100, oftenn 200+ ppl still move and run arround, pushing, smacking, killing evrything in his way.

So how come that in EU mob with wery big strenght and weight is unable to push players with average 100kg weight?